prodracing.com

Unofficial SCCA Production Racing Forum
It is currently Sun May 22, 2022 5:53 am

All times are UTC - 8 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 126 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 11:21 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2019 5:57 am
Posts: 268
Improved Touring cars are not limited by lift, they're limited by being the stock unmodified camshaft.

As such, they are not field-checkable, they need to be subjected to either comparison to a known-stock part and/or the optical comparator thingy that Topeka has.

Of course, known-stock examples likely don't exist any more for the vast majority of the cars.

Even if you were to start putting max lifts on the IT spec lines against which to spot-check them in the field, where are you going to get that info? The FSM (it's not in there)? The competitors themselves? If so then my ITB car (which can run in HProd) has a .575" lift cam stock.

It's one big ole loophole that someone can drive a truck trhough, and one of the big technical reasons Improved Touring has never been considered for Majors/National status.

Inclusions of other classes into your own carries a ton of baggage with it, most notably the very important need to keep on top of those classes' regs changes as well as your own. I watched some heads asplode this past weekend when some STL competitors suddenly realized that the STAC's allowance of all ITS cars also allows in 2.5L straight-5 VWs and 3L straight-6 BMWs. I tried to demonstrate the pitfalls of doing that by entering an ITS car in STL for the 2015 Daytona Runoffs; but for a couple of stupid driver errors I damned near put that car on the podium.

GA


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 8:51 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2011 6:59 am
Posts: 1618
Location: Spring Hill, FL.
Each car would need a line with cam lift /compression and weight . IMHO. To avoid the VW mk 3 deal that ruined ITB.

Basically like I stated earlier . L3 level of 10.5 compression, .425 lift and weight per CC.

_________________
Mike Ogren/Protech Racing, http://www.FWDracingguide.com http://www.ogren-engineering.com/ 352.428-8983 mogren@tampabay.rr.com


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2021 5:58 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2009 6:16 pm
Posts: 336
Location: Kannapolis N.C.
Somewhat ironically the ITB Volvo 140 has .425" valve lift and 10.5 to 1 compression stock.

_________________
Sam Moore
SCCA competitor since 1983


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:21 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2011 6:59 am
Posts: 1618
Location: Spring Hill, FL.
What a coincidence?
How light can you get a 142? I built a couple and prepped a couple more . Seems like they were heavy .


Maybe we can list them @ 425 lift and 10.5 /1 and take off weight . With L2 chassis prep .
List them all and see if any show up and tweak the weights from there.
BMW 320, 318 ,2002
Audi 5 cyl
Volvo 140 series
VW Mk 3 . ( is close as IT prepped )
FWIW an ITB Volvo runs about 2;21 at Watkins Glen, Mid pack in HP . LR is about 2:16
Daytona . Mk 3 VW runs in the middle of the HP times.
So maybe IT weight is a good start . The Mk 3 would pick up 10+ HP with a good cam .

_________________
Mike Ogren/Protech Racing, http://www.FWDracingguide.com http://www.ogren-engineering.com/ 352.428-8983 mogren@tampabay.rr.com


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 11:41 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2019 5:57 am
Posts: 268
The dam has a leak!!!

(a.k.a, "...and it begins...")

SUBJECT: Errors and Omissions, Competition Adjustments, Clarifications, and Classifications
All changes are effective 5/1/2021.

3. #30132 (Hayes Lewis) Appeal of Request to Move Porsche 924 to HP
In HP Spec Lines, classify Porsche 924 (76-84):

1. #30350 (David Reiter) Change Classification of 84-87 Mazda 626 from FP to HP
In HP Spec Lines, classify Mazda 626 (84-87):


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 12:41 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2011 6:59 am
Posts: 1618
Location: Spring Hill, FL.
The Mk 3 Golf is 60#s too light at2325# It will put down 150 or more at the wheels. Should be 2400# .
The Mk3 runs in the middle of HP field in IT trim ..

The 626 is also too light by about 100# or a little more . Should be 2400# .

_________________
Mike Ogren/Protech Racing, http://www.FWDracingguide.com http://www.ogren-engineering.com/ 352.428-8983 mogren@tampabay.rr.com


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 6:20 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2009 6:16 pm
Posts: 336
Location: Kannapolis N.C.
But we are still sceerd of Volvos???

_________________
Sam Moore
SCCA competitor since 1983


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 7:49 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2019 5:57 am
Posts: 268
Sam Moore wrote:
But we are still sceerd of Volvos???

No.

But 92hp (crank) Porsche 914s?

<shudder>


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 3:42 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2009 9:12 pm
Posts: 1389
Location: Cbus, OH
To help put some light on what you guys are talking about, all of these went into HP, and all with the same 11.0:1 & .425" allowance:
- Volvo 142/142E at a base weight of 2450lbs
- Porsche 924 (76-84) at a base weight of 2400lbs
- VW Golf/Jetta mk3 (93-98) at a base weight of 2325lbs
- Mazda 626 (84-87) at a base weight of 2300lbs


Greg Amy wrote:
But 92hp (crank) Porsche 914s?

<shudder>

I think it should be moved up to EP, just to be sure...

_________________
Kevin - ruckracing - '15 & '10 Runoffs FP Champion
Hoosier | AEM | Wilwood | Hasport | BrianCrower


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 6:02 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2011 6:59 am
Posts: 1618
Location: Spring Hill, FL.
They are all tooo light except the 142. The 142 has the least power potential of these.
Should all be 2450.

The 914 should fit of course .
My apologies to the class .

_________________
Mike Ogren/Protech Racing, http://www.FWDracingguide.com http://www.ogren-engineering.com/ 352.428-8983 mogren@tampabay.rr.com


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 126 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13  Next

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group