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 Post subject: Roll Cage Tubing ID
PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 7:49 pm 
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I have Jamie Housman's old 1978 Civic Gt3 car. It was built in the 80's so it's more like a production car than what is raced in that class today. It's a very slow project. I kept finding things wrong so I just gave up and stuffed in into the corner for about 12 years, but now I think I would like to work on it again. As I have tossed the broken/damaged stuff only about half the original car remains and I think more of it is about to go to the dumpster. So that brings me to the next hurdle. The cage was built in the 1980s and I am not sure what the material is. It has a CASC log book but no SCCA book. I will never class race it, but I think it may make a fun open track / vintage car one day if its finished. I have no idea what the tubing is and it may be important in the future. The new rules say DOM only, no log books for ERW. So once the cage is painted how can anyone tell? The tube is way over minimum thickness at .120 wall. Just wondering if I have to do a complete tear out or an update?


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 Post subject: Re: Roll Cage Tubing ID
PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 7:56 pm 
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If its a track day car no one will care. To see if its ERW tubing usually a caliper is all that's needed. ERW is not really very round. It will have a flat spot when measuring across where the weld seam is.


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 Post subject: Re: Roll Cage Tubing ID
PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:07 pm 
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Thank you for the information. I will go check with a caliper. I have my suspicions, but hoping for DOM. It's the SCCA vintage classes that run at PIR that are my concern as I think i would have to have an SCCA Log book to run. http://www.oregonscca.com/vintage-racing.html The turnout has been dropping severely though, so if I put off the project much longer, I may not have to worry about it. Still I figure it's better to know at this stage and not have to do it later.


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 Post subject: Re: Roll Cage Tubing ID
PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:43 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2002 2:52 pm
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Location: Just south of Indianapolis
Have you talked to jamie. Www.racegearbox.com

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 Post subject: Re: Roll Cage Tubing ID
PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:11 pm 
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Yes, Jammie is great, super friendly and helpful. He sent me a lot of information on the car about 12 years ago. He even took pictures off his office walls and sent me the originals. The car has been through several owners and updates, if you can call them that so I am not sure who did what. The car originally won a best engineered award when it was first built. When I got it, it was far from that and there were some very scary issues. The log book was also noted as needing some cage work even from CASC when it was last raced in the late 90s so its not a total surprise. It's not a huge deal. Most of the drivetrain and some panels are replacements anyway. I did check with calpers and the tubing is slightly out of round. Fast and easy way to check so thanks for the info.


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 Post subject: Re: Roll Cage Tubing ID
PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 5:21 pm 
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Location: Northeast PA
There should be an inspection hole drilled somewhere on the cage, usually on the passengers side of the main hoop. This hole is used to not only measure the tubing diameter, but to also check for an internal seam on a painted bar. If ERW was used, the old rule was that the seam needed to be oriented to the inside of any bend. A piece of wire inserted into the hole and “scratched” around the inside of the tube would get slightly “caught” against the welded seam. If it is smooth around the entire circumstance of the tube, it’s usually DOM.

With a caliper and a scrap of wire, it’s easy to tell.


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 Post subject: Re: Roll Cage Tubing ID
PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 7:15 am 
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Thanks for the information. I chopped out the cage a few days ago. When it was out in pieces it was very clearly ERW. I just started thinking with all the work that has gone into the project, it would be a shame to crutch the redo the bare minimums on the roll cage, even if it was for trying to preserve more of the original car. If its DOM and done nice, I just don't have to worry about tech on cage material no matter what event.


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 Post subject: Re: Roll Cage Tubing ID
PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:04 pm 
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Location: Oregon City, Or.
don-f wrote:
Thanks for the information. I chopped out the cage a few days ago. When it was out in pieces it was very clearly ERW. I just started thinking with all the work that has gone into the project, it would be a shame to crutch the redo the bare minimums on the roll cage, even if it was for trying to preserve more of the original car. If its DOM and done nice, I just don't have to worry about tech on cage material no matter what event.



Too bad, you should have checked with Oregon Region Tech, I believe you could have made a good case for a vintage logbook with no changes if the cage was built safe.

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 Post subject: Re: Roll Cage Tubing ID
PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2020 5:17 pm 
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ERW was legal for a long time .

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 Post subject: Re: Roll Cage Tubing ID
PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2020 8:49 pm 
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Joe Harlan wrote:
Too bad, you should have checked with Oregon Region Tech, I believe you could have made a good case for a vintage logbook with no changes if the cage was built safe.


It needed new door and harness bars per the CASC log book in the late 90's. I may have been able to squeak by with just updates, but there always would be the uncertainty. The car is at least two years from completion, if I really started working hard. A lot can change in that time. I would rather do it once and be done.


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