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 Post subject: Re: MX5 Cup car in EP
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2018 8:17 pm 
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Location: Ozark Mountain Region
S. Henry wrote:

My understanding which may be wrong, is that it can't run in tourning in Global MX5 form... The non-DOT tire thing gets them tossed in Touring?

.



With respect because I appreciate how hard it is to manage all the CRB does on first take, I think the CRB should take another look. Why is it considered nothing to create a completely new and different additional level of prep, the specs of which are not even in SCCA control, in a strong performing EProd class, and yet to simply allow a different tire construction be used in a struggling Touring class, considered too disruptive ?

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 Post subject: Re: MX5 Cup car in EP
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2018 10:42 pm 
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Problem solved. Given that nothing on the GMX5 Cup car is illegal in Prod, I asked the adhoc to classify the 2016+ MX5 as a regular EP classification. That will allow the GMX5 to run as a normal, albeit underprepped EP car. Or it may bring out a real live EP quality car. Either way, based on the complaints here, it ought to be a shoe in to get classified.

Any complaints?


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 Post subject: Re: MX5 Cup car in EP
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2018 11:06 pm 
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dhrmx5 wrote:
Problem solved. Given that nothing on the GMX5 Cup car is illegal in Prod, I asked the adhoc to classify the 2016+ MX5 as a regular EP classification. That will allow the GMX5 to run as a normal, albeit underprepped EP car. Or it may bring out a real live EP quality car. Either way, based on the complaints here, it ought to be a shoe in to get classified.

Any complaints?



Makes perfect sense to me. This is how it should be done.

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 Post subject: Re: MX5 Cup car in EP
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 4:26 am 
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They also can't run the cup brakes in touring.

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 Post subject: Re: MX5 Cup car in EP
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 5:25 am 
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I received an interesting phone call over the weekend from Randy Smart, the guy who wrote the letter. Please take a look at the letter.

Page 26:
https://www.scca.com/downloads/40727-18 ... g/download

The request was to classify the 2016+ MX5 in EP, as that's where all other 1.8L and up Miatae are classed. Sounds logical.

What came out of the CRB was this Global MX5 Cup mess, not the MX5 as requested.

There was some other back story to it with a GMX5 car entered in EP at COTA and then money refunded and sent home because he didn't have a place to race and those running the show at COTA refused to let him enter an event, event when there were only 16 cars in the entire run group. (I've seen 90+ cars on that track before- one more car certainly wouldn't have hurt..)

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 Post subject: Re: MX5 Cup car in EP
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 5:31 am 
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zChris wrote:
why would you want to run your fiberglass bodied cars with a full on 2400 lb steel bodied full crash bumpered car.


Chris, you're being too narrow minded here. My car is all metal (OK fine, fiberglass hood and trunk), and has all the crash stuff behind the factory bumpers, and weighs 2675.

My car has been classed in EP for at least 7 years, probably more. Why object now?


Last edited by blamkin86 on Mon May 07, 2018 5:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: MX5 Cup car in EP
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 5:34 am 
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Location: Philly
To flesh out Jesse's post, these are not EP compliant cars. Requesting them to be classed in EP, as they are, will not work. The brakes they run are aftermarket big brakes.

The BFGs are no better than the Hoosier DOT tire. Leaving them in T3 is the most sensible option. The only place where I see they can be classed legally is GT2. That's not going to work. If this is a COTA only issue, they can put something in the supps for that race.

But let's also remember that the real reason these cars are being classed anywhere is to let them test/get seat time.

The club has a provision for that. SPU. They can run regional races to their hearts delight. And with the return to "Rationals", it's mostly just the Super Tour races that they can't run. And why do we want folks testing in the middle of our big show?

Bitching up the prod (or Touring for that matter) rules for these cars is a bad idea.

Let me ask this ... why did the T3 guys reject these cars? Hint ... it ain't the tires.

-Kyle


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 Post subject: Re: MX5 Cup car in EP
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 5:42 am 
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disquek wrote:
Let me ask this ... why did the T3 guys reject these cars? Hint ... it ain't the tires.

-Kyle

My guess is "Not in my backyard" , just like we're seeing in EP.

Secret Car Club of America keeps to itself. even to keep out someone who's running SCCA Pro.

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 Post subject: Re: MX5 Cup car in EP
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 5:53 am 
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S. Henry wrote:
If I was king, I'd take cars in EP like the 944 or some super powerful BMW and knock off 20 HP, then I'd take 100 lbs out of it or something similar to get trap speeds and corner speeds as close as possible...


I'm you're huckleberry.

I can quickly and inexpensively take about 50lbs out of my car. I could find some flat-plate restrictor, and find some way to back out 20hp; of course that costs money. You would have a hard time taking away the torque, IMHO.

I'd submit a couple other points:

1) The fastest two miatas in the country (Eric P and Matt R) have incredible programs and have built on their successes for years. They are not buying miata parts on the internet and throwing them on and winning.
2) If you believe in Production classes, you believe that all cars should have an equal chance of winning, given enough different tracks out there.

The horsepower cars SHOULD dominate at Daytona, and maybe RA. The Caterham and Miata SHOULD dominate at MO and very likely Sonoma.

How the hell do you take cars with such different engine sizes and expect them to be the same at every track?

Make them all the same? How are you going to put a double wishbone suspension on an old BMW?

What you really want is to protect your investments. You want the miata to be able to win at any track.

In short, you don't believe in production class having any parity whatsoever. I go to heartland, which is absolutely a handling track, and try and get close to the fast guys. That's my goal.

I don't hope to add 100lbs to a miata so that I can beat you at HPT.

But somehow, here we are taking 100lbs off my car and taking some horsepower away.

Honestly, if you want the miatas to win everywhere, and you're willing to change the rules to make it so, then you don't believe in class parity at all.


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 Post subject: Re: MX5 Cup car in EP
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 9:22 am 
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Just making a point that cars that are more similar typically race better together.
It’s not a spec class (or a 1800 lb great handling class) and never will be, That was kinda my point

I suspect we are more aligned than you think and agree with much of your post. Stop by and ask me sometime.

I was lured into this topic by the amount of bad info being posted but will save this for face to face conversations going forward.

Sam


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